There’s been quite a bit of…unsettlement (totally a word) regarding the news that Discord has a new CEO and the company is going public (typically a sign of things going shittier than before).
I’d just like to re-post this which I shared some time ago, if you’ll indulge me in my rare post which isn’t a Steam Deck / Gaming News # post - a rarity for me.
In the end, this is not the be-all-and-end-all alternative, it won’t be for everyone. Matrix exists of course. But this is a nice place. And I thought considering recent events I’d recommend it regardless!
Following is just a copy of what I posted last time. It’s mostly Linux chat, gaming, handhelds (like the Steam Deck), movies and…general chats. Anyway, here’s the post:
So…this one is a bit left-of-field.
A friend of mine (Gardiner Bryant of YouTube - who reports on Linux and the Steam Deck) has started a Revolt server.
What is Revolt?
It’s kinda like a FOSS alternative to Discord. You’ll see the layout is almost a direct copy, and it’s far less polished…but then again you haven’t got the downsides of Discord’s constant upselling either:
Why is this relevant?
…I can hear you ask? Well, so far its just a few developers and creators in there, but I thought of all spaces…maybe those very devs and creators whose work you use and watch…well it might be nice to join in there?
My personal friends who are in here so far are:
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imLinguin whose GitHub is here - but you may know most as a developer of Heroic Games Launcher
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Lazorne whose project is RetroDECK - my personal fav emulation option for the Steam Deck
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Eben Bruyns whose GitHub is here - but you may know best as the dev of Junk-Store
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Kyle Gospo whose project is Bazzite
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Gardiner himself, of course whose YouTube link is here,
What is the damn link to the damn server, woman?
I mean, you will have to make an account on Revolt, but it might be interesting to some here. You’re all very welcome!
Revolt to Discord is what BlueSky is to Twitter.
Just another continuation that can (and will) enshittify.
In addition to the mentions that this isn’t encrypted, doesn’t have video chat, etc, it’s also difficult to set up with little documentation and an enormous tech stack. They also had some recent controversy about open source licensing that gives me a bit of worry. I decided to go with a self-hosted synapse server.
If Discord is going to be abandoned by people, I wish we’d go back to proper forums that’s much more accessible and searchable. Continuing down this road is just going to lead to the continued burying of useful information behind these services.
We need both for different purposes. Discord is amazing for voice, video, and IM chatting. All things that happen in real-time. But forums are intended for a vastly different use case. Forums are play-by-post. They’re asynchronous. They’re meant for responding at your earliest convenience, not for talking to someone right now. The fact that so many people began using Discord as a forum replacement is a travesty, because Discord is a fucking atrocious medium for forums… Not due to any fault of Discord’s, but because they’re completely different use cases.
Forums are just not great for real-time interaction like discord chat is, not to mention the integration of voice chat, video streaming, etc is just too convenient to give up without replacing it with something similar. I too wish discord/whatever replacement gets attention was more searchable and kept stuff long-term, but… if you want to post info that lasts, post it on lemme and link it on discord or whatever.
You’re on a forum right now, no? I think a lot of Discords have accompanying Reddits and vice versa, hopefully they start using Lemmy. But forums are still popular. Just not Ye Olde BBS
Not nearly enough of them. Too many frameworks or libraries have their QnAs on Discord instead of a dedicated forum.
I think we just need to split roles again.
Discord did there best to be an all in one solution and we just need a return to real time chat and voice along with asynchronous communication like forums
Amen! I remember the good old days of speciality community forums based on VB or even phpBB or in some cases Woltlab. I miss the simpler times.
Revolt isn’t federated, encrypted, has no video chat, claims privacy but that claim seems to be simply because they are based in Europe. The layout is nice and ui is better than element but that’s the only upside i see. I hate the matrix client ui’s and chat sorting options.
I really hope indie gamedevs start moving off Discord. Sometimes it’s the only source for finding help or reporting bugs.
Yeah, and it’s doubly infuriating because Discord is not a good replacement for support forums. It isn’t searchable via search engines, and even the built in search is fucking dog water.
Let’s say I have an error, so I google “{Program} {Error code} Solved”. With a forum, I would find a thread that is already talking about the specific error, with comments regarding troubleshooting steps or a solution… But with Discord, all I get is a generic link to the program’s server.
And even once I’m in the server, there often isn’t a good way for me to find existing threads about my specific error. Maybe I check the pinned messages, but some servers have dozens of channels; am I expected to check the pins on every single channel? Oftentimes that seems to be the expectation, because asking a question will often just get a “check the pinned messages, ya thud-fuck” type of response.
Or maybe I search it, but (again) am I expected to search every single channel? And since Discord doesn’t use fuzzed searches, searching for “Error code 0x00548327” won’t return any results if the thread simply uses “Error 548327” instead. With Google (or any half-decent search engine, really) you get results for both. But not with Discord.
So instead, I ask in the support channel. And that leads me to my final gripe… My response takes actual effort from another person in order to solve. Maybe I get lucky and they have a bot set up to respond to a keyword/error number in my comment… But if not, or if I didn’t use the specific keyword that the bot was searching for, then I need to rely on other people. If there are 200 people with the same issue, that’s 200 times that someone needs to respond to what is essentially the same message. With a forum, you could simply find the post, and read the responses. No human interaction necessary, because it has already been done. The question and answer process has already happened. But with Discord, I’m forced to wait on someone to actually respond, and the devs/admins actually need to dedicate time and resources to ensuring it gets answered. That constant vigilance takes a lot more time and effort away from actual mod duties.
It’s a comically bad experience.
I get it that it’s probably easier to setup a Discord server, than to run your own forum, but you can always get a managed solution or use reddit (I would prefer if Lemmy was used, but I am also realistic).
I’m actually against companies running their own subreddits, purely because I’m an old redditor who remembers when it was specifically disallowed by Reddit. The original intent was for the site to the run by the people, not by companies. Companies were actually prevented from moderating their own subs; the worry was that they would use their mod powers to suppress any sort of negative press or criticism, no matter how valid.
For instance, maybe there’s a popular TV show. The company wasn’t allowed to have a hand in moderating the official fan sub for the show, because it was left up to the public. If the show did something unpopular, the broadcasting company shouldn’t have the ability to suppress the criticism about it.
But Reddit has since done a complete 180 on that topic, and now goes out of their way to install corporate moderators. Subs are now run as an extension of the company’s marketing and/or PR departments
Agreed. Just at this point I think it’s fair to say that this policy is definitely not in effect.
Is it e2e encrypted?
Damn, that’s… quite the line up of Steam Deck related devs, shit.
Welp, I’m convinced.
I got distracted when I started inviting people I know into the server, so…there will be more to come!
In terms of desktop applications, looks like Element and Revolt look pretty comparable these days. Mobile app Revolt looks better to me. Matrix seems way more established considering downloads of Element (there’s numerous Matrix applications) on Google Play and FlatHub
Mobile app Revolt is nice, but doesn’t support servers that aren’t the main one yet last I tried.
By memory there’s a community-made app for Revolt as well, but I can’t remember what its called, or the git link! When I find it again, I’ll link it here :)
So why not matrix?
Is revolt federated?
Unfortunately, nothing else has really matched Discord’s combination of voice, video, and text chatting. Matrix doesn’t have feature parity, and doesn’t even have a functional client… Which means it’s only really viable for the people who care enough to learn how to set it up. And the average user does not care enough to learn.
I’m not sure what you mean? I have voice, video and text working on my yunohost without any real issues. My wife and I use it all the time. Element (the client) could be a bit easier def on the initial experience, but to me that’s it.
The thing discord has is the people. When discord went down a couple of weeks ago, my tiny instance quadrupled in users. And the local city specific matrix got quite a few.
Discord is too big at this point for people to leave it. I’ve never heard of revolt until now, I don’t see a need in switching because of a new CEO that hasn’t done anything yet.
Nor me either, but I’m going to start packing my parachute now. You probably said the same about Reddit a few times before you ended up here, too.
Nothing is too big to end. I’ve seen so many VOIP clients over the years and Discord is just another.
Software isn’t forever. Services come and go. Empires fall.
Regardless, the drive to switch is in selfhosting. If you want actual security and not to have to worry about a corporation handing their logs over to the Feds, Revolt is very appealing.
Perhaps, but we’re now in an age where IPO announcements, CEO changes and even new features inevitably lead to enshittification. There is no harm in having a backup plan.
I’d even say that anyone who doesn’t have a plan B is an idiot, given recent history.
Discord’s fine now but it sure won’t be in 5 years. Companies going public like this always end badly
How do you know that for sure?
Take a look at Snapchat, Microsoft Solitaire, or most dating apps. That’s what this usually looks like after 5-10 years.
So free? With a paid sub option? Hmm… Maybe they can call it nitro or something. Maybe limit fil size sharing I less you pay the sub too. Oh and lock streaming quality too!
That just proves they’re already willing to make it worse. Dating apps have $500/mo plans now. Snapchat is 95% ads, 5% chat
