I’m an immigrant working in the USA, I came here because of the promise of a better tomorrow, a meritocracy, a seat at the table at big tech, and for a while it felt real but then my company was acquired by a larger entity and it all went to shit, now I’m in a race to show I’m the most competent and dedicated person with the most technological knowledge to keep my job and not get layed off.
If I ask my manager or my director a question or challenge their thought process I get called into a 1 on 1 meeting where I’m told I’m a great asset to the team but me asking questions of them in a team setting sets a bad example, and my questions aren’t in bad faith infact in the meeting I was lauded for asking the right questions, but being pulled aside and being asked to kiss the ring felt disgusting.
At one point in my career I cared about what I did and who I worked for I felt pride over my product and my team, and all I feel now is shame to be associated with my company, I feel disgusted with myself that I work not for my customers but for shareholder value.
So I guess my question if any is are there still companies that exist in the USA or outside that still give a fuck about what they’re doing and not just inflate that companies value so it can be sold or keep the stock price going up.
I would love to live and work somewhere where my value isn’t determined by how much money I van make or how much shareholder value I increase, I wouldn’t have to worry about a visa and if I can/will be kicked out if I’m no longer employed.
I could go back home but the work culture there is atrocious it was the reason why I had left, I lasted 5 months and I couldn’t take it and put in my 2 weeks to go to the US for a Masters degree in Computer Sciences.
I’m sorry that this turned into more of a rant than anything else but I’m at a point where I don’t really know what I want to do anymore, any advice or conversation is appreciated.
I’ve worked for a small business in tech for 15 years- it’s a great company that cares for its people. I think some of what you’re describing is just the nature of larger companies. The bigger the machine, the smaller the cog.
More to this point, it comes down to who owns the company, meaning the shares. Fiduciary responsibility is a real thing and is responsible for some of the worst things going on in the world right now.
Yep agreed and that why I want to exit the industry as even th3 end goal of a smaller company is to sell out to some investors or to get bought out by a larger company.
I dont see any new tech company that genuinely cares and will not sell out but everyone has a price and that why I need to exit capitalism.
Yep, I used to work for mid sized company and it was amazing, problem is no small(?) to mid size company seem to want to sponsor visas.
Good point. I believe it’s $$$ and is tough for smalls. Best of luck on your search!
Thanks!
I have a couple decades experience as a software engineer and manager. I don’t know if you’re ready to hear my answer, but here it is:
You might be in a bad situation, it’s hard to say with a single data point. There are bad bosses out there and it can be a nightmare, even at a good company. The “easy” fix is to try working on a different team or a different company and see if that solves the issue. Easy is in quotes because, as an immigrant, it may be tough to move to another employer.
The harder answer is to look inside yourself.
Your title asks about non-capitalistic companies. There are non-profits, but I don’t think capitalism is your problem here. You’re still going to run into problems at non-profits or even volunteering in open source if you aren’t able to integrate well with teams.
There are always going to be cultural expectations no matter where you go. The situation you described about having a 1:1 over asking questions suggests you either have an overly sensitive manager or your manager is right and you are not effective with your feedback. Asking questions can open up conversations or be used to bully people you disagree with.
The way you disagree matters. It’s not enough to be right, you need to persuade other people to be right too. As a manager, I’m focused on the team’s output and if one person is causing problems with the group dynamic, I’m going to address it.
I’m hiring right now and have passed on candidates who fall into the “brilliant jerk” stereotype. There’s research that shows that those types drag the rest of the team down. Remember, I’m focused on the entire team, so any one person needs to fit into that context.
If you find that your interpersonal skills need a boost, “How to Win Friends and Influence People” has good advice but it’s hard for some people to accept advice like “let other people be wrong when it doesn’t matter” and “compliment people.”
The other thing I’m reading in your post is that you may be burned out. The classic solutions for that are therapy, rest, exercise, and investing in life outside work. It’s hard to spot burnout sometimes, but check in with your support group.
So that’s 3 options forward: change your situation, improve your skills, or rest up and recover from burnout. Good luck.
Thank you for your comment, I really appreciate you taking the time and your analysis, I’m not sure if its relavant but by th3 end of the 1 on 1 the director apologized to me when they realized that what i had asked actually furthered the conversation and that they were hurt that I would make that statement at the time and in that group as they felt I was just digging up old corpses, when they were explained my thought process and what I meant and what I asked and that the point of that statement was to ensure we dont fall into the same pitfalls again, I was calm and kind in the meeting. I do agree I think i have been burned out for a bit and this whole situation felt bad, and I do agree that this is an industry/employement thing that I can’t really escape from.
And the other thing is I dont want to have to influence people to do my job, I dont want to have to walk on eggshells if i need to get someyhig done I’m an engineer my job is to give you the logic and the solution, they are th3 managers/directors and they need to facilitate my job, not tell me that me asking about our environment strategy and avoiding teams in silos is something they should feel offended by.
I agree with the OP’s response. It was well written and gave you several options. In particular, the point about cultural expectations sounds like the most pertinent. I don’t know what your working relationship is with your director, but the fact that they first apologized and second, when they understood your motives, lauded you.
It does suck having your good faith questions misinterpreted. However, it’s unclear what your director did or said that made you feel you were kissing his ring. Did he scold you? Or just explain how he felt about your question?
Others have given resources about coops and flat heirarchies, but this sounds like you want a very specific corporate culture. Even in the right fit, you are influencing people and will have to work with their personalities. Politics will always be part of the game as long as there are limited resources and risks in allocating those resources.
Thank you for your response sadly I can’t explain better without divulging internal information and politics, while I agree with you that influence and politics would be an issue everywhere as a manager or a director there are ways to shield your employees from higher ups which doesn’t happen here, we are thrown under the bus until I have to step in and explain what happened, why it happened and defend my coworkers, I have had better managers and directors and this was more of a poor manager/director in my opinion. My manager, director, all the up to the VP are from India and they are bringing the same culture from India the one I came here to get away from. It’s disheartening to hear “get with the program” from y’all, dont get me wrong but there are jobs where people don’t have to deal with this, my previous manager before the acquisition and him being layed off cared enough that this kind of non sense wouldn’t even reach me, especially stuff like this from a director, and y’all telling me “suck it up” doesn’t feel too good.
but being pulled aside and being asked to kiss the ring felt disgusting.
You are absolutely right here. It is a very shitty boss. They can happen everywhere, but still not all are like that one.
I am an expert in my field, too, and I would have my way of withstanding such a guy. Not sure, however, if it is possible in Usa. I am in Germany.
are there still companies that exist in the USA or outside that still give a fuck about what they’re doing and not just inflate that companies value
There are. At least here. The work culture is much better in general (but very different between companies), because such single specimen of asshole bosses are not that powerful here. Firing somebody is a regulated process, and things can be reviewed later by independent people, in the company or in court.
As long as companies are not that huge, they usually care better about what they are doing.
I was looking into immigrating to Germany but the thing that a few people told me and caused me hesitation was the 55%(?) taxation rate that seemed high, and the language barrier I remembered back when I was in undergrad that Germany required you to learn the language and I found that intimidating at the time.
55%(?) taxation rate
Not true. But the real rates are quite complicated. Do not believe any simple statements to this :)
Germany required you to learn the language
All countries require that, unless you don’t want to really live.
Yep, high taxation rate is a concern but not more than my sanity. And yea English came naturally and lucratively US seemed the best option in my 20s, harder to pick up a language I was never exposed to will be a challenge but should be doable I think.
I hope you find your way to a civilized country.
Thanks :)
There are non profits, that is about it for this capitalistic hell scape. You do not need to volunteer at them, plenty have actual jobs. They can’t pay market rate, but more of a non profit rate, but it’s not bad
Yep I shall look into non profits and try my luck to see if I can land a job there.
To improve your work conditions you have to demand it for yourself. As long as workers allow it to happen, their bosses will do everything to increase profits on the expense of the workers. Unionising your workplace is the only secure way to gain back your power.
While I agree with you, I can’t really do that as any form of push back could eventually lead to.my dismissal, I’m on visa and as such I’m very expendable there’s thousands to take my place if I slip up.
Do you have coworkers with the same complaints and risks? I understand that it’s risky but I also don’t think there’s an alternative option as all companies eventually will use the same exploitative practices.
Yea I agree a union would be a better long term fix but not sure of the viability.
Traditionally, there have been a few classes of companies in the U.S: C Corp, S Corp, LLC (Limited Liability Company) aka partnerships, and Closed. Most companies in the U.S. are organized as one of these, with their responsibility toward shareholders, who want to see their money grow.
If you wanted to work for a company that didn’t necessarily have infinite growth as its mission, the only option was to find a Non-Profit, but they may not have the kind of funding to spend on legal visas.
In the last few years, two other types of companies have emerged. They’re similar, but legally different: B-corp (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/B_Corporation_(certification)), and PBC or Public Benefit Corporation (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benefit_corporation).
These can be for-profit, but have to have a stated mission in their charter to provide a benefit of some sort to the public.
The links above point at some examples, but you may want to do your own research. Those companies may have the resources to pick up your visa, and may better align with the values you’re looking for.
Ideally, and when able, your best bet would be to start your own business and set it up just the way you want.
Thanks for the information, I will look more into B corp and PBCs.
I’ve never worked for a for-profit company since I graduated college. There is variation in non-profit employers, but there are some that are great places to work.
I got a job at a university after graduation (different university than where I got my degree), and I worked there in different departments until I took a job in the university hospital. I’ve worked here for more than 25 years.
The pay tends to be a bit lower than what you’d get at a for-profit company, but not as bad as some would lead you to believe. I’ve been able to buy a home, raise a family, and live fairly comfortably.
The benefits are very good. There’s a strong focus on education and growth, and work-life balance isn’t just a lie they tell people in the interview.
Yep from the recommendations here I will be looking into non profits and see if I can get hired into one.
Generally in almost any setting, uncomfortable questions should only be asked in private.
I dont think what I asked was a sensitive question it was about environment strategy and avoiding teams working in silos, so I don’t think it was something I needed to talk about / ask about in private, I do appreciate your perspective though.
